FLORIDA FIREARMS – Law, Use & Ownership

Shooting out the tires of an escaping vehicle in Florida.

copyright 2019 by jon gutmacher

     Well, I got a question from a friend on Facebook referring to the incident summarized below from Marysville, Washington, and then asking whether shooting out tires in such an incident in Florida would be a good idea. Here’s the news story:

     “MARYSVILLE, Wash. – Authorities say two men were surrounded by customers with guns while attempting to steal tools from a Washington store. The Daily Herald reports the men, ages 22 and 23, allegedly took four nail guns, each worth more than $400, from the Coastal Farm & Ranch store Saturday in Marysville. The men walked out of the store and got into a Honda Civic, only to be surrounded by about six customers with guns raised. Court documents say the driver pulled forward, causing one man confronting him to land on the hood. Documents say another customer shot at the driver’s side front tire, while a third fired twice at the rear tire. Marysville police found the theft suspects’ car unoccupied about three blocks away, with two flat tires and the tools inside. Both men were apprehended after a search.”

      So, let’s analyze the situation:

      This is a very interesting scenario because the total dollar value of the tools makes the crime of theft a “felony”, whereas a theft from a store of merchandise is often just misdemeanor shoplifting. But, even with the value of the tools being a “felony quantity”, in Florida it was not a “forcible felony” because it wasn’t a “robbery”. A robbery requires a taking by use of threat or force. Sure, in most states, what the customers did was totally legal – because their actions were “reasonable”. A few years ago, it probably would have also been legal in Florida. However, a major change in Florida law that added “threats of deadly force” into Florida Statute 776.012, threw out that protection by some really bad legislation due to horrible drafting that changed the entire meaning of the statute. (Hey, I warned everyone including the NRA, the Legislature, and even Florida Carry that it was a bad bill – but nobody really seemed to believe me, or care.) Anyway, in Florida – shooting out tires of an escaping vehicle short of a “forcible felony” would likely be illegal, and a serious crime.

     Why?

      Because Florida law only allows the use of a “threat” of deadly force (ie: here – the display of firearms in a threatening way) – in a “forcible felony” situation, even if the display of the firearm was otherwise reasonable, and even prudent (often as a bluff to stop the crime). F.S. 776.012. Of course, it gets worse if you actually discharge the firearm, as that ups it to the “use” of “deadly force” under Florida law – not just a “threat”.

     Now, I know somebody is gonna say: “Well, when the customers surrounded the car, and the thieves still tried to flee and resist – didn’t that up it to a “robbery” – which is a “forcible felony?”

      My answer is “no”. Because in order to up it to a robbery – a store employee would have to be added to the equation – not just customers, as F.S. 776.012 is NOT the statute that pertains to the situation – instead – the statute is F.S. 776.031 – (defense of property) – and that requires either an ownership connection of some type or actual “duty” to protect.

      So, should you shoot out the tires in such a situation? Hell – I wouldn’t. I’m not saying anybody in law enforcement would care if you’re in a gun friendly area of the State, because in the scenario given, I think shooting out the tires was entirely reasonable. But, 776.012 says I’m wrong – since “reasonable” doesn’t matter in Florida as applied to threats short of responding to a forcible felony. Find yourself in one of the the many, many anti-gun cities and counties here in Florida – and not a real smart idea.